peterfarrington
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imikhail, thank you for this very interesting and important collections of patristic and Coptic references. I am posting it all here as text because it is so important. The question I would like to know is when the practice changed since most other…
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Well that does confuse me because it is a Sunday and it is the season of Pentecost and everything I have read says that Orthodox should not prostrate.
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So did you prostrate this morning during the absolutions of the raising of incense?
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But that is standard in English. And the problem is that your translation is not how others, including the translator of the Coptic New Testament, have chosen to translate this phrase. It cannot surely be as simple as you describe if others, even o…
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Why do you prostrate when the canons and tradition forbid it?
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mina, I am not entirely clear. What do you mean by saying that some prostrations are allowed. I can understand those directed in respect towards a bishop, as they are rather cultural, but it seems to me that the canons just forbid all prostrations…
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I am also interested in the various practices of the Coptic Church. I instructed my own congregation not to make any metanias today but to bow. Indeed I was reading a homily of St John Chrysostom yesterday which described this as his own practice. …
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And if it is reflexive then could it not just be an emphasiser that it is Christ Himself who has risen or is risen. Indeed how can any modern reader of Coptic be aware of the subtle nuances of Coptic, or any other nearly dormant language as I am aw…
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Christ rose himself is not English though. In English it would be Christ raised Himself. I wonder why the translator of the Coptic New Testament chose to translate this as Christ rose? Remnkemi what is your view?
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imikhail, your translation of the Coptic seems different to Remnkemi, and to the scholarly translator of the Coptic New Testament. So I am confused now as to the correct translation. The form 'Christ raised himself' is not complicated in English, …
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dzerhemi, Google translates 'Christ is risen again' as 'Christus resurrexit' so I guess that it is indeed an early version of the translator and cannot be relied on. This may not be the topic of this thread but I wanted to assure that Bikhristos af…
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That is difficult indeed then. Has the Church stood against this unjust law? Has there been agitation in the West to make this practice known? I do have to say that the situations I have heard of where women have been pressured to return to abusiv…
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How is it necessary to be abused by a husband to receive salvation? I am very confused!!
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resurrexit and surrexit have the same verb ending? Surely resurrexit means 'to rise again' and surrexit means 'to rise'? Why is resurrexit translated everywhere I can find as 'is risen'?
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Thanks for your interesting points dzheremi. I do understand what you mean. But I would still like answers to my questions in relation to Coptic. I guess I am comparing language to Church architecture. The architecture used in a Church building say…
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That's interesting because the Latin form of the greeting is Christus resurrexit! Which, as far as I am aware, means Christ IS risen! It would be interesting to follow the path of the translation of the greeting into Spanish. When did this take pla…
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I don't think that there is a formally constituted state of 'separation', which ISTM leaves the abused woman in a position of some risk. I may well be wrong. I am also not sure how the Church formally handles the process of divorce. I do not beli…
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Thanks for that very interesting information Remnkemi, and the interesting material from all other participants in this thread. It is interesting to see how the Christian message is transmitted in various languages that present their own linguistic…
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In my opinion a separation would be a formal recognition that the marriage had broken down due to the actions of one party and that the injured party was no longer subject to her abuser as her husband and was free to live separately and free from hi…
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In English there is a clear distinction between 'Christ is risen' and 'Christ arose'. Not that one is correct and one is incorrect, but they convey different nuances. One describes an ongoing state which began at some time in the past, but the focu…
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It is indeed the case that abuse is not usually grounds for divorce, but it would be appalling and wicked even to tell a woman who was being abused that she must put up with it. Again I will say that the Church should have a clear policy as to how …
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I agree with mabsoota, The use of the phrase depends on what is being considered. The Coptic does seem different, in that it translates as 'he rose', while all the other translations from Greek say 'is risen', or 'has risen'. Nevetheless the pasch…
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I am not sure that we are taught not to associate with our enemies. Indeed, as far as is possible, we should try to win them over. Those we should not associate with are especially those who are caught in wicked and immoral behaviour and habits, in…
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If you don't know what it is you should not believe it at all. This is really not the Orthodox way at all. All our Fathers tell us to be very careful and discerning and to hesitate to accept anything like this. We should not accept things on the b…
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I would be interested to learn the relative ages of the collection of hymns available in the present. If a graph was drawn of age and quantity do we have any idea what it should look like?
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The development of the traditions about the Virgin Mary in the Oriental Orthodox communion would be interesting. There are lots of apocryphal works and as the subject relates to Christology it is well represented in our Fathers.
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I guess that St Severus was swept up in the general condemnation of anyone who maintained the traditional terminology of 'one incarnate nature'. This was often taken by the Chalcedonians to mean that the humanity of Christ was denied, though even a …
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Exactly. Once I had memorised the Gospels of St Mark and St John I found the memorisation of the Book of Romans much easier, and now the Book of Isaiah is proceeding quite quickly.
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What languages do you have?